Can faith sustain courage and openness in a polarized democracy? Former Ohio governor and presidential candidate John Kasich reflects on faith, fear, character, and public life amid deep political polarization and religious tension in America. “There is a certain comfort in knowing you have somebody who’s always in your corner.” In this conversation with Evan Rosa, Kasich reflects on personal faith shaped by tragedy, the search for purpose, and why character matters more than ideology in leadership. Together they discuss religious faith in American life, his experience running in the 2016 Republican presidential primaries, voting on character over beliefs, firm political commitments, open-minded perspective taking, his vision of a life worth living, and before the end of this conversation, you’ll find out his favorite Metallica song. Episode Highlights “There is a certain comfort in knowing you have somebody who’s always in your corner.” “You can be firm while at the same time looking at a point of view of somebody who’s diametrically opposed to you.” “I look for character. I don’t look for what somebody thinks about the Book of Revelation.” “Faith informs the way I think about things, but it doesn’t spell out what I’m going to do.” “If you begin to work together to solve a problem locally, it can actually create friendship.” About John Kasich John Kasich is a former U.S. congressman, two-term governor of Ohio, and presidential candidate with more than four decades of experience in public service, media, and civic leadership. First elected to the Ohio State Senate at age 26, he later served 18 years in the U.S. House of Representatives before becoming governor in 2011. Kasich has authored six books exploring politics, faith, leadership, and civic responsibility, including his most recent, *Heaven Help Us: How Faith Communities Inspire Hope, Strengthen Neighborhoods, and Build the Future*. He is known for emphasizing character, dignity, and community-based solutions over ideological rigidity. Kasich frequently speaks on leadership, faith in public life, and democratic renewal, and continues to engage across political and cultural divides in pursuit of common purpose. Learn more and follow at [https://johnkasich.com](https://johnkasich.com/) and https://twitter.com/JohnKasich Show Notes - Growing up Catholic, altar service, early religious formation - Tragedy in 1987, parents killed by drunk driver - “Where do you stand vis-à-vis your eternal destiny?” - Faith as ongoing window of questioning, not certainty - God’s existence, care, and personal relationship - “Faith itself is a gift. God has to act first.” - Fear, loss, and the backstop of divine presence - “You’ve got the most powerful being in all of history kind of got your back.” - Faith shared as gift, not coercion or argument - Voting based on character, not doctrinal alignment - Scripture informing decisions, not dictating policy - Respect for the poor as moral baseline - Christian nationalism and the question of objective truth - Politics and faith distinct, neither hostile nor coercive - Singles win games, local action over grand crusades - Faith communities as clubhouses for moral action - Working locally dissolves partisan hostility - Life worth living as purpose, gifts, and contribution - Character, integrity, and not taking advantage of others - Freedom from fear, boxes, and rigid identities - Kindness versus niceness as moral distinction - Open-mindedness as antidote to boredom and fear - Campaigning as test of endurance, character, and empathy - “People wanted to know who you were more than your ideas.” - Pursuing convictions while staying rooted in faith communities Production Notes - This podcast featured John Kasich - Edited and Produced by Evan Rosa - Hosted by Evan Rosa - Production Assistance by Noah Senthil - A Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/about - Support For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give #FaithAndPolitics #CharacterMatters #PublicFaith #CivicLife #CommonGood #JohnKasich
Can faith sustain courage and openness in a polarized democracy? Former Ohio governor and presidential candidate John Kasich reflects on faith, fear, character, and public life amid deep political polarization and religious tension in America.
“There is a certain comfort in knowing you have somebody who’s always in your corner.”
In this conversation with Evan Rosa, Kasich reflects on personal faith shaped by tragedy, the search for purpose, and why character matters more than ideology in leadership. Together they discuss religious faith in American life, his experience running in the 2016 Republican presidential primaries, voting on character over beliefs, firm political commitments, open-minded perspective taking, his vision of a life worth living, and before the end of this conversation, you’ll find out his favorite Metallica song.
Episode Highlights
“There is a certain comfort in knowing you have somebody who’s always in your corner.”
“You can be firm while at the same time looking at a point of view of somebody who’s diametrically opposed to you.”
“I look for character. I don’t look for what somebody thinks about the Book of Revelation.”
“Faith informs the way I think about things, but it doesn’t spell out what I’m going to do.”
“If you begin to work together to solve a problem locally, it can actually create friendship.”
About John Kasich
John Kasich is a former U.S. congressman, two-term governor of Ohio, and presidential candidate with more than four decades of experience in public service, media, and civic leadership. First elected to the Ohio State Senate at age 26, he later served 18 years in the U.S. House of Representatives before becoming governor in 2011. Kasich has authored six books exploring politics, faith, leadership, and civic responsibility, including his most recent, Heaven Help Us: How Faith Communities Inspire Hope, Strengthen Neighborhoods, and Build the Future. He is known for emphasizing character, dignity, and community-based solutions over ideological rigidity. Kasich frequently speaks on leadership, faith in public life, and democratic renewal, and continues to engage across political and cultural divides in pursuit of common purpose. Learn more and follow at https://johnkasich.com and https://twitter.com/JohnKasich
Show Notes
Production Notes
#FaithAndPolitics
#CharacterMatters
#PublicFaith
#CivicLife
#CommonGood
#JohnKasich
This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors.
Evan Rosa: From the Yale Center For Faith and Culture, this is for the life of the world. A podcast about seeking and living a life worthy of our humanity.
John Kasich: In the early profiles of me by reporters, they got aggravated with me 'cause they were trying to put me in a box. Everybody always wants to put people in a box. Oh, I've got it. You can't put me in a box because I don't operate in a box. Okay. And I'm not some weirdo here. Okay. I'm a normal guy. Okay? I just went to see Metallica about a month ago.
Evan Rosa: In this episode, I'm joined by just a normal guy. You know, the kind of average Joe who's been in politics for half a century and ran for president twice.
John Kasich: I sort of just stumbled into it and I try to tell people, don't copy the way I got into it. This is
Evan Rosa: John Kasick. At 26 years old, he was elected to the Ohio State Senate.
John Kasich: I was elected very young, the youngest ever in the state Senate. No family support, no political support. At 30,
Evan Rosa: he was elected to the US House of Representatives,
John Kasich: went to Congress at the age of 30, got elected there. Spent 18 years, and then I said, okay. For this, and I went out and tried a bunch of other stuff
Evan Rosa: at 35.
His parents were both killed by a drunk driver.
John Kasich: When I went through the tragedy in 87 of losing my parents, it provided me an opportunity to not only understand where I was, vis-a-vis these big questions of life and eternity. The same time, I also spent time trying to figure out who the heck John Kasick is.
Evan Rosa: At 47, he made an unsuccessful bid to be the Republican presidential nominee.
John Kasich: See, 'cause I tried to run in 2000 and my friends walked me into it. They wanted me to go out there and go around the track and see what it was like, and it was really tough.
Evan Rosa: At 59, he became the governor of Ohio.
John Kasich: Polarized society where everybody's fighting with everybody.
If you begin to work together to solve a problem locally and ground up, you just don't care much about what their politics is, and it can actually create friendship.
Evan Rosa: At 63, he ran in the Republican presidential primaries again, defeating Trump in the Ohio vote by a margin of 47% to 36%.
John Kasich: I mean, I have nothing negative.
To say about it. Really the only problem is I didn't have enough money. If I'd have had a lot more money, I think I'd have won, but I didn't.
Evan Rosa: At 70, he found himself in that shrinking minority of Republicans joining the opposition to actively campaign against Donald Trump.
John Kasich: You know, I endorsed Biden. I thought he was gonna be a unifier.
I turned out to be totally wrong, but. This is what I did. I don't have any regrets. I mean, I wish he had been a better president
Evan Rosa: and at 74 he published his sixth book. Heaven. Help us how faith Communities inspire, hope, strengthen neighborhoods, and build the future.
John Kasich: You know, I, when I wanna say to young people, I know you get into political club or you get into some.
And you get so firm and that's okay. You can be firm while at the same time looking at a point of view of somebody who's diametrically opposed to you. It's possible to find value in everything that people say, even if you don't agree with him.
Evan Rosa: He joins me to talk about religious faith in American life. His experience running in the 2016 Republican presidential primaries. Why he votes on character over beliefs, what it means to hold firm political commitments while maintaining an open-mindedness, his vision of dignity and a life worth living.
And before the end of this conversation, you'll find out his favorite Metallica song. It's not a deep cut, but it's a solid pick. Thanks for listening today, governor Kasick, it is such a pleasure to have you on for the life of the world. Thank you for joining me. Thank you, Evan. Thanks for having me. I thought it'd start with just asking you about your religious sensibilities, where they came from, your background spiritually, and where you find yourself today.
John Kasich: Well, look, I grew up as a Catholic boy, was very involved in the church as both an altar boy, a commentator, and all that. Went to college, drifted away, and then had a very significant moment in 1987 when my parents were killed. Mm-hmm. By a drunk driver. And then I had a preacher. Come to see me and he said, you know, where do you stand vis-a-vis your eternal destiny?
And I couldn't have an answer to that question very, very effectively. And he said, well, look, you have a window of opportunity to go through and try to figure out where you are with all this. And so that was in 1987. That's almost 40 years ago. Yeah. And I'm still through the window of opportunity, still trying to figure out where things are, you know what I mean?
Would
Evan Rosa: you expound a little bit on figuring out, because I think so many people are in that same kind of situation. The figuring out the working out of these questions is not easy task.
John Kasich: I started off by saying, okay. Does God really exist? Does God know who I am? Does God care who I am? And fortunately, and I think it happens in many, many cases, the good Lord sends some people around me who helped me to navigate this.
Some of them are my best friends today. And you know, there was no question that I wouldn't ask. I mean, it was aggravating to some, but I always would just say, well, how do you know that? And why do we think that? Yeah. And I would push until it things got settled in my mind. And I don't think I ever doubted that God existed, but I just didn't have, uh, you know, a relationship basically.
It's not about how many times you go to church or how many times you cross your head and you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's really about a personal relationship with the father and the son. It's as I told this guy the other day, God loves you. He cares about you. He knows what's going on. Take Jesus with you.
When you're going to do something, he's for you. And, uh, you know, when it seems like no one else is, he's for you. And, um, build a relationship just like you build a relationship with your friends, build a relationship with him, and how do you go by doing it? I think, I think it's always helpful if you have a guide, somebody that you know.
For example, when I talked to this one young man about this, he lives in North Carolina. I have a friend that lives in North Carolina. He's gonna be his kind of his shepherd. And without the shepherd, it's easy to fall away and say, ah, I don't have time for this. But I'm pretty optimistic that we got this guy paying real attention and hopefully my friend will guide him and, and I also think faith itself is a gift.
God has to act first. And the question is, when he acts, do you listen? And that doesn't mean he's gonna give you some mysterious voice. He could be communicating to you through another human being. That's kind of the way I look at it. And the reason it matters to me, Evan, or for anybody who might be listening, trying to figure this out, there is a certain comfort in knowing you have somebody who's always in your corner.
That does not mean that all things work out right. But I happen to believe that for those. Who love God. All things work out at the end for those who love God regardless of what it is. Yeah. And so to me, this is just a great opportunity for somebody who's sort of drifting or thinking about their faith.
Yeah. To dig down deeper. There's nothing more important than that as opposed to the Yale, Harvard football game. I mean this, this matters certainly, and it's not scary by the way. Just take one step in front of the other. Talk to people who you know, have a faith and ask them what their lives are like and what can you do and what should you learn from them.
Yeah.
Evan Rosa: I would like to ask you about fear, because it seems to me like. Most of the conflict that we experience today is driven by a kind of fear, whether it's a nationalized fear or politicized fear, and then also the fear of loss, the fear of tragedy striking. It's really fascinating to hear you say, you know, there's nothing to be frightened of or nothing to be scared about.
It's one foot in front of the other.
John Kasich: Well, it is, it is. There is fear and you know, we all have our own fears, whatever they may be. I'm just saying that the backstop. If you can come to accept this is, you got the most powerful being in all of history. Kind of got your back. There's a, a great writer named Helme Icky, who was a preacher during World War ii, and he writes that nothing that ever happens to us doesn't go through the hands of God, and that he shapes it in such a way that will ultimately work out best for those that love him.
I mean, there are people that are hearing this saying, you're crazy Kasik. You don't know what you know, you're nuts. You don't even, I, yeah, no, I do know. 'cause I've been through it and I've seen others go through it and you can't make it up. Mm-hmm. You know, you can't just say, oh, I believe that it has to come to you.
And that's up to God mean he is the one that has to kind of put this in your heart. So we can't do it. You can't do it. I can't do it. But he can do it. And I think he wants to do it. I do
Evan Rosa: wanna bridge to the book too. Ask you, given the very personal nature of religious sentiment and the kinds of existential questions that come along with the kind of seeking that you're talking about, the seeking of answers, the seeking of courage and understanding that the, the current religious debate in America.
Not to mention, you know, religious nationalism's rising around the globe. How do we bridge from a personal experience of religion to a public experience of religion, in your opinion?
John Kasich: Well, the way I look at it is if I talk to somebody about this, I'm kind of giving them a gift. Hmm. I mean, I don't look at it like I've gotta bend him anybody's arm, or I've gotta argue with him, or how I am is an instrument, and if I believe that it's critical for your eternal.
Destiny and destination to be linked to this. I'm just gonna tell you about it. I'm gonna say, Hey, here's what I think. Take it or leave it. I mean, I'm not here to beat anybody in the submission. It's just, to me, it's a one-on-one kind of a thing.
Evan Rosa: But I'm, I'm also thinking about the interest of, let's say, the average voter to identify with a candidate who shares their values and beliefs.
Some kind of personal level where,
John Kasich: yeah, I don't, I'm not too much into that. I mean, I, when I vote, I look for character or when I wanna spend time with people, I look for character. Uh, I'm not saying, okay, what is their view of Romans? And then I could figure out whether I wanna vote for or not, or are they reading the old and New Testament?
I mean, that, that's just not important to me. I'm not gonna go and ask him, well, what do you think about the Book of Revelation? No, I'm, I'm not interested in that.
Evan Rosa: And I'll be honest, neither am I. I'm more interested in, in the ones that have appointed theological dimensions around, let's say like the teachings of Jesus regarding the poor or the stranger, or things that have political dimensions to it.
Like in so far as there's a politics of Jesus.
John Kasich: Yeah. I don't go in, I never, all the years I held elected office, which for 30 years. Had a lot of decisions to make. Yeah. Particularly eight years as governor of the, the seventh largest state and all kinds of issues coming at you. Right. I didn't go into the book to figure out what I should decide, but, but my faith informs the way I think about certain things.
You know, if you're agnostic or whether you're a believer, I just don't think poor people can be run over. And I think poor people need to be respected and honored, and you can get that from the scripture. You can get that by being a, you know, just a good person, the void or separated from religion, but it just informs the way I do things, the way I think about certain decisions I have to make now.
But I'm not even in politics. I still have many decisions to make, and so it just informs me, but it doesn't spell out what I'm gonna do.
Evan Rosa: For me, the question is kind of coming from. Well, I think there's obsession on, on a couple fronts with Christian nationalism, the conversation in America about religion and the growing tendency of owning that particular label, that America is a Christian nation, and deviating from that is, is a problem for some voters.
Well, that's, that's kind of their issue, not
John Kasich: mine. Yeah. I'm just asking what is that doing in the American public debate right now? I don't hear a lot about it myself. Okay. I kind of don't get involved in that stuff. You know, I'm not a, hmm. First of all, I believe that that America's founded on basic Jewish and Christian principles, and I also believe that one of the great challenges we have today is the issue of objective truth.
That objective truth has been disappearing from our culture. So if you don't have objective truth and you have subjective truth, that means everybody can kind of do what they want to do. There are no rules, there's no standards, there's no guidelines. Hmm. And I think, you know, objective truth fundamentally stems from the great religions, particularly the Jewish and Christian faith.
So I'm interested in objective truth, but I'm not interested in shoving something down somebody's throat. See, to me, politics and faith should be separate. I don't think the state should be hostile to faith, but at the same time, I'm not here to say that the faith community ought to be imposing. It's rules and its values on the state.
I just don't subscribe to that. Yeah. It's an individual process. See, we have too much of the time, we try to figure out how to hit a home run with men on base rather than just getting a single, yeah. Singles wing games. I could be making a lot of money in the major leagues right now if I batted 300 and all I'm interested in doing is sort of communicating.
What I think is helpful to people whenever it's appropriate and let them decide. The idea of turning this into some sort of a, a crusade is not something that I would participate in.
Evan Rosa: No, certainly. And I can see that in your book insofar as the way that you want to represent multiple viewpoints and investigate the particulars of individual stories to reveal how people of faith are impacting their community with common purpose.
John Kasich: Yeah, and the book was designed to say. If you feel strongly about an issue, you know, I guess you could say a moral issue, how we treat children, what we do about those who are human trafficked, what we do in bringing three religions together, Jews, Christians, and Muslims. If you are concerned about hunger or disaster or whatever, there's a way for you to go to an institution of whatever religion you are part of.
And create a clubhouse for yourself where you and others like you can gather, where you can get some resources, some encouragement. Those are the kinds of things that, to me, that's what this book is about. And in a polarized society where everybody's fighting with everybody, if you begin to work together to solve a problem locally, 'cause I believe in local and ground up.
When you work with somebody else, you just don't care much about what their politics is. It can actually create friendship
Evan Rosa: for me, that kind of corresponds with, um, a recent concept I've been thinking about, which is our mood or our feelings or our sentiments follow our actions in the sense that if you flip it around, if, if you only act out of how you're feeling, sometimes you don't feel like reaching across the aisle.
Sometimes you don't feel like finding common purpose. But if we can kind of generate the activity, then we might find, yeah, that the shared sense of purpose comes after we simply begin working together.
John Kasich: Look, nobody wants to see hungry kids or hungry families. No one wants to see somebody who's been human trafficked, locked in prison.
No one wants to see the homeless, not in some way or another taken care of, or I should say, remedy the situation. I don't know anybody that's against that. It's just a matter of how you do it. And. Every local community can have a different way to address all of these critical issues.
Evan Rosa: At the Yale Center For Faith and Culture, we run a program called Life Worth Living.
It's taught to Yale students, undergrads. They explore different wisdom traditions, and we often ask folks that come on the show as well as students in the class, what is a life worth living? What makes a life worth living? And I'm curious what your response to that question would be.
John Kasich: Well, first of all, all life is precious.
But my sense is how you find meaning in life is when you can dig down and feel your purpose and your gifts. 'cause everybody has purpose, everyone has gifts. Everyone's made special. When you take that and follow a roadmap that can help you to connect with that sense of what you have inside, I think that's where you find satisfaction in life.
That's my sense of it. I mean, if you're young and you, you want to heal people, you wanna be a doctor. That's a great thing. Or if you, you know, you kind of like the argument, then you become a lawyer. Or if you are really good at building things, you become an engineer. I think that when you can pursue those things that you feel, you know, that's part of your DNA, I think that you can find satisfaction.
The other thing is, I believe that over time it just shouldn't take advantage of other people, and you ought to have character and integrity and that's one of the things you can get from faith. Is character and integrity and know how you should treat others and how you should treat yourself. You know, we all like to have money, but everything isn't all about money.
It's also just a sense of are you contributing something to society? Are you leaving things better for the fact that you were there? What
Evan Rosa: about for you personally? Tell me about your early sense of vocation and how a decision to enter politics. Would line up with this question of, uh, a life worth living.
It was a choice
John Kasich: you made. I sort of just stumbled into it and I try to tell people, don't copy the way I got into it, that I was elected very young, no family support, no political support. Four years in the legislature. I was the youngest ever in the state senate. Went to Congress at the age of 30, got elected there, spent 18 years, and then I said, okay, enough of this.
And I went out and tried a bunch of other stuff. And, you know, I've been on Wall Street, I've been on television most of my adult life really since I was about 25 years old. I, um, have written six books. I, you know, I make speeches. I mean, I, I've taught in universities, I've had all those things that I feel really, like the Lord has looked out for me.
I just feel. So lucky and at the same time just being comfortable with where I am. And today I'm pretty happy. And I'm free. That was the other thing I would tell you is when I went through the tragedy in 87 of losing my parents, it provided me an opportunity. This is important too, an opportunity to not only understand where I was, vis-a-vis these big questions of life and eternity.
At the same time, I also spend time trying to figure out who the heck John Kasick is because as you know, Evan, everybody's got socks in their drawer that are not matched the right way. And so it gave me an opportunity to try to think about what I was made of and who I am and open myself up to that. And I hope you can tell.
Or if you've ever followed me, I'm a pretty happy guy. I'm free. Free. I don't feel trapped by any people around me. Certainly can tell that you were talking before we came on about running for president. In the early profiles of me by reporters, they got aggravated with me 'cause they were trying to put me in a box.
Everybody always wants to put people in a box. Oh, I've got it. You can't put me in a box because I don't operate in a box. I don't operate within certain lines. It aggravates my wife who says, sometimes you think the rules don't apply to you. I said, well, yeah, you're right. I do think that, but that's not always so good.
But the fact is, is that knowing that I have a relationship with the Lord through thick and thin, and I'm not some weirdo here, okay. I'm a normal guy. Okay. I just went to see Metallica about a month ago. Okay. Alright. You know, I like to play golf, you know, I even move the ball from time to time. Although I'm getting better at that, I like to say that golf is about hope, and the hope is, will tomorrow be better than today?
I, I mean, it's very seldom that you walk off a golf course and say, I think I got it right. That's a curse anyway. But it's like, you played terrible, but you leave and you go, tomorrow I'm gonna do better. I mean, that's just the way it is. It's like a game. It's a game of optimism. And then you get out tomorrow and it's.
It's like insanity, right? Doing the same thing over and over. But it makes it a good metaphor for life. It, it's, and I'm just a normal person. I don't know what's around the corner, but I know that what could be around the corner can just be so devastating. Yeah. You've experienced it. Yes. But I don't wanna live with that fear.
But what I can live with is the notion that somehow, some way, no matter what comes, the Lord is gonna help me through it in one way or another. And my life here on Earth is short, and my trip into eternity is gonna last a very long time. It's funny, but I just got the, the, uh, uh, the Chronicles of Narnia, you know, and I, here they go into an another dimension and only step back into reality.
You know, when you think about. Eternity. That's like a long time, Evan, and I wanna be on the right side of that and I'm gonna be on the right side of it if I can just carry out my mission, be as good a guy as I can. Repent all that. And then at the same time, I'm an older guy, but I have a lot of young friends.
You know, why is it I don't, it's a style. It's just a way of being open to things. And so like, if you're a student and you're 18, 19, 20, okay, lock yourself in. But as time goes on, open your mind. If you open your mind, you become a much more interesting person that if I could always predict what you're gonna say.
I mean, it's like an AI model, right? I know what you're gonna say. Just let me turn the machine on. No, I don't want you to be that way. I want you to, I want you to surprise people. You know, I, when I wanna say to young people, I know you get in a political club or you get into something and you get so firm and that's okay.
You can be firm. Well at the same time. Looking at a point of view of somebody who's diametrically opposed to you. It's possible to find value in everything that people say, even if you don't agree with them.
Evan Rosa: And only a person with an open mind I think can say that confidently because the alternative is fear of the other person's mind.
I think.
John Kasich: Well, I don't wanna go there because I might get confused about what I think or Or I'm so rabid in my views. Yeah, that's okay. And I think that kind of leads to boredom. Okay. Yeah, that's what I think. But you don't wanna be there. And look, it's sort of funny for me to give this kind of advice, but one of the things that comes with getting older is I like to think some wisdom, and then you begin to see things in a little bit of a different life.
I just like to be around smart, successful, aggressive people, and not just smart people, but people who have ideas, people who have something to say. Everybody has something to say. Maybe we just need to slow down and listen to them. I think that's true too. You, you, you referred to your
Evan Rosa: mission, but also this, this question like, who is John Kasik?
How would you answer that
John Kasich: question? Not what I say. It's what somebody said to me. They said that you are, how did he put it? You are a, basically a change agent. I shake things up. Hmm. And um, but he said, you are kind. He didn't say nice. 'cause sometimes I'm not very nice, but I'm kind. If I need to help somebody, I can.
It's an important distinction. I'd say kindness versus niceness. Yeah. I said somebody, well, which would you rather me be nice or kind? And they're like, how about both? I said, no, you don't have it. Both make a choice. It's a good distinction. I think I, I was nice that that man said that. I like that. And I remember, or maybe it was kind of him.
It was kind of him. Yes.
Evan Rosa: Before we go any further, I gotta ask you about Metallica, because I mean, you can't drop that and, and then not share like, some of your favorite songs and why you love 'em or why you were there. Uh, well, well
John Kasich: because, you know, like I have a wide taste in music, you know? I mean, okay.
Tell me about it. Well, I mean, you know, I, I went to my first Springsteen concert this year. I've never been a big Springsteen fan, or it was, maybe it was last year. I couldn't believe how great the show was. But you know, I like Lincoln Park. I've met the guys in the band. You know, I've been friends with Bono for 25 years.
My goodness. Um, I liked Killers. I like Pearl Jam. I like all them. Yeah. But I went to see Metallica. 'cause you know, you know, they're Metallica. Yeah. And they, Metallica I went with, um, I think it was like six guys. We went in a cyber truck. Just had a great time. And, um, do you have a favorite song? So everybody likes Sandman, right?
Yeah. Yeah. And, um. What's the, I always get the name wrong. It's my favorite one. Um, is it Nothing lasts forever or, oh, nothing else matters. Nothing else matters. That's my favorite Metallica song. I mean, it's a beautiful song, you know, the other one I like though, I'm not a big fan of Coldplay, it says, I sweep the streets that I used to own.
Oh, there are lyrics in that song. A Viva la Vita. Oh,
Evan Rosa: Viva Levita, right?
John Kasich: Okay. Yeah. And I laugh about it because you know, like when you're governor you used to own the streets. Now I sweep the streets maybe a little too close to home. It's right there. It's perfect. It's perfect. Yeah. I'm always known when you're in, you're in.
When you're out, you're out. But you know what the key is when you're out, you can still be in. Tell me, which means still somebody that's, you know, making
Evan Rosa: things happen. I do wanna just ask about running for president. Not a lot of people have this personal experience, and it was such a momentous year at this point in your life.
How do you look back on that campaign
John Kasich: fondly? Very fondly and uh, I loved it all really. I mean, it was so tough. You just go from town to town to town, and you just get dog tired. I don't know how the heck we did it in New Hampshire. They did over a hundred town hall meetings. Wow. And what I learned was that people didn't care so much about what your ideas were.
They wanted to know who you were and if you could show people who you were and you could show them that you have a concern about them, they like that more than your ideas on cutting taxes or fixing social security. But it was great. I can go all over the country, met so many people, and then I never went into the ditch.
You know, I never got into the name calling or any of that, and it served me well and I've, I've stood on, on my own principles for what I felt was right and unifying. And at the time it got a lot of people angst, you know, about a lot of things. I didn't worry too much about that. I mean, the only thing that matters to me is, is my faith, my family, and my dearest friends.
Yeah. And I mean, dear friends, I don't mean like peripheral friends, I mean Sure. You know, we have this term called friends. You gotta think about what a friend really is. And so that's what I care most about. And then I kind of talk to them about what I might do. I endorsed Biden. I thought he was gonna be a, a unifier.
I turned out to be totally wrong, but you know, it's just what I did. I don't have any regrets. I mean, I wish he had been a better president, but running for president, I mean, and be a legitimate candidate, it takes a lot and I mean, I have nothing negative to say about it really. The only problem is I didn't have enough money.
If I'd had a lot more money, I think I'd have won, but
Evan Rosa: I
John Kasich: didn't.
Evan Rosa: The discernment process is something I've wondered about. The discernment process personally, and I'm not talking about, you know, the ability to raise money, but really coming to believe that yes, I want to run for president, one of the most powerful, if not the most powerful office in the world.
John Kasich: Well, you know, when I first ran for office at 25, I had been working in the legislature. I was writing bills and speeches for the guys I worked for, and also watching the operation of the whole body. And I thought to myself, well. I can do this, I think better than they can do it. So I decided to run, and then I won running for president.
I felt that I offered the country more than anybody else did. Mm-hmm. And not out of a sense of arrogance, but out of a sense of accomplishment and vision and what I thought we needed to do. And it took a while. I mean, it wasn't like I woke up one day and said I'm running. I had conversations and talked to my friends about it, and I just said, okay, I'll go for it.
And I needed to go for it, only from this standpoint. It could be legitimate. See? 'cause I tried to run in 2000 and my friends talked me into it. They wanted me to go out there and go around the track and see what it was like. And it was really tough. Mm-hmm. And I got in, but then got out early. And it was not enough there.
Sure. But this time I ran in 16, it was all there. And I knew I could, I could do it. I knew I could launch it. And so finally they would get me off the bus. 'cause you know, there'd be people standing outside and the press would be there. And then as soon as I would walk into the room and the peep were there, it just changed everything.
And I mean, part of it is you fed off the people, but only in a way. That you understand that they had some hopes and dreams and if you somehow could fit into that. Yeah, that'd be really cool. And it's a really good question. It's something to think about. I dunno if I'll ever write about it, but you know, it's fun to talk about it.
Evan Rosa: Absolutely. What a, what a unique experience.
John Kasich: So let me just, and let me end this, if I could, Evan, by saying if you have something you feel strongly about. Then I would suggest you pursue it, but don't cut out those institutions of faith. Yeah. And talk to the people who run the church, the synagogue and the mosque, and tell 'em what's on your heart and tell 'em you need help.
Regardless of what it might be, and see if you can get support. Mm-hmm. And you can accomplish something very significant. It might not seem giant to the world, but it's giant to you. You never know what those little things are that end up moving the entire world.
Evan Rosa: Thank you so much, governor Kasik, for your time.
It's great. Thank you. You're good at this. Ah, thank you so much. Hopefully we'll do another one
for The Life of the World is a production of the Yale Center For Faith and Culture at Yale Divinity School. This episode featured John Kasick, production assistance by Noah Sentil. I'm Evan Rosa and I edit and produce the show. For more information, visit us online at faith dot Yale dot edu. Or life worth living dot yield at edu.
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